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 Post subject: All Things Wikileaked: Assange granted asylum by Ecuador
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 8:16 am 
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Wikileaks outs 400,000 classified Iraq War docs

US military 'ignored torture'


By Cade Metz • Register



Wikileaks has released nearly 400,000 classified US military documents involving the Iraq War, defying warnings from the US government that disclosing the documents would put lives at risk.

Dubbed "the Irag War Logs." the documents were posted to the whistleblower site at around 21:00 GMT on Friday, after they were released to various news organizations across the globe. According to the The Guardian, the documents show that US commanders ignored evidence of torture by Iraqi police and soldiers and that more than 15,000 civilians died in incidents that weren't previously reported.

Though US officials have said that they kept no official record of civilian deaths, the leaked documents also show that 66,081 civilian died among a total of 109,000 war fatalities, according to The Guardian. The UK paper also reports that a US Apache helicopter crew killed two insurgents on the ground although the men tried to surrender and that the crew was cleared to do so by a US military legal advisor.

It's believed that the document came from the same source that leaked roughly 92,000 classified documents involving the Afghan war to Wikileaks earlier this year, About 77,00 of tose were posted to the site, drawing strong criticism from the Pentagon, which said that the leak would endanger Afghan civilians who cooperated with the US military.

US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton declined to comment on today's leak specifically. But she said the government "should condemn in the most clear terms the disclosure of any information by individuals and or organizations which puts the lives of United States and its partners' service members and civilians at risk."

Defense department press secretary Geoff Morrell was more direct. "We deplore WikiLeaks for inducing individuals to break the law, leak classified documents and then cavalierly share that secret information with the world, including our enemies," he said in a statement.

"We know terrorist organizations have been mining the leaked Afghan documents for information to use against us, and this Iraq leak is more than four times as large. By disclosing such sensitive information, WikiLeaks continues to put at risk the lives of our troops, their coalition partners and those Iraqis and Afghans working with us. The only responsible course of action for WikiLeaks at this point is to return the stolen material and expunge it from their Web sites as soon as possible."

The 391,832 US Army Sigacts (Significant Actions) reports outed by Wikileaks document the war from January 1, 2004 to December 31, 2009 – though reports for two months are not included in the leak. You can read more from Al Jazeera here and The New York Times here.

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 1:25 pm 
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izzie wizzie, lets get busy :spawny: <makes manutd4ever appear>

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 5:43 pm 
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brilliant vid.


well i hope this puts to bed all this crap about 'oh we went there to bring democracy and free the country' my f!kn arse we did! shooting and killing pregnant women?? mass genocide?

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 5:45 pm 
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"By disclosing such sensitive information, WikiLeaks continues to put at risk the lives of our troops, their coalition partners and those Iraqis and Afghans working with us..."


you mean your p!ssed off and them for exposing whats been really goin on.

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 6:12 pm 
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absolutely true, but nonetheless it puts soldiers lives at greater risk

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 7:02 pm 
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Resurrection Joe wrote:
absolutely true, but nonetheless it puts soldiers lives at greater risk



i dnt think many 'insurgents' hiding in the mountains or the civillians living in their smashed up homes are gonna be reading this on the net or on bbc world news are they, thats just some sad excuse i think, the leaders who put them there in the first place have put their lives at risk, dropping white phophorous, depleated uranium on them is gonna put their lives at even greater risk.

this is something they didnt want out, but thanks to wikileaks atleast all those muppets who think the sun shines out the arse's of our military can sit down and take note of whats been really going on.

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 7:15 pm 
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Months Later, Defense Secretary Gates Reveals Wikileaks Document Leak Didn't Actually Reveal Intelligence Sources



Back when Wikileaks leaked tens of thousands of documents on the Afghan war earlier this year, the US government went into full out assault mode against the organization, accusing it of all sorts of things, including Defense Secretary Robert Gates claiming that the leak [url]had compromised "intelligence sources and methods[/url]," leading others to claim that Afghani informants were being killed over the leaks. That became a common theme, and we had numerous commenters insist that such informants were being killed. For many, it's now considered fact.

Turns out... it's not. The very same Robert Gates has now admitted that it turns out no intelligence sources were revealed. The same article quotes a NATO official as saying that "there has not been a single case of Afghans needing protection or to be moved because of the leak." Of course, considering how widely reported the claims of such leaks were, many will continue to believe it's been proven as fact, despite the very same person who kicked off the rumors now admitting they weren't true.





Gates: Leaked documents don't reveal key intel, but risks remain

By Adam Levine, CNN




* NEW: No cases of Afghans needing protection because of leak, source says
* More than 70,000 classified documents were posted to Wikileaks in July
* Defense Secretary Robert Gates says the leak did not disclose sensitive sources
* But he warns that Afghans named in the documents could face Taliban reprisals


Washington (CNN) -- The online leak of thousands of secret military documents from the war in Afghanistan by the website WikiLeaks did not disclose any sensitive intelligence sources or methods, the Department of Defense concluded.

Secretary of Defense Robert Gates said there is still concern Afghans named in the published documents could be retaliated against by the Taliban, though a NATO official said there has been no indication that this has happened.

The assessment, revealed in a letter from Gates to the Chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee, Sen. Carl Levin (D-Michigan), comes after a thorough Pentagon review of the more than 70,000 documents posted to the controversial whistle-blower site in July.

The letter, provided to CNN, was written August 16 by Gates in response to a query by the senator regarding the leak of classified information.

Gates said the review found most of the information relates to "tactical military operations."

"The initial assessment in no way discounts the risk to national security," Gates wrote. "However, the review to date has not revealed any sensitive intelligence sources and methods compromised by the disclosure."

The defense secretary said that the published documents do contain names of some cooperating Afghans, who could face reprisal by Taliban.

But a senior NATO official in Kabul told CNN that there has not been a single case of Afghans needing protection or to be moved because of the leak.

"We assess this risk as likely to cause significant harm or damage to national security interests of the United States and are examining mitigation options," Gates wrote in the letter. "We are working closely with our allies to determine what risks our mission partners may face as a result of the disclosure."

Gates also said there is still the possibility of more documents being published, for which the Pentagon is preparing.

Over the summer, the Pentagon created a team of more than 100 personnel made up of mostly intelligence analysts from various branches of the Defense Department as well as the FBI, who were involved in the round-the-clock review.

WikiLeaks has approximately 15,000 more Afghanistan documents that the site is reviewing because they contain names or other sensitive information. While initially the sitefounder, Julian Assange, had vowed to publish the additional documents after redaction, there is now some question whether that will happen given the intense criticism WikiLeaks came under after Afghan names were found in the already published files.

Additionally, WikiLeaks is expected to publish as early as next week about 400,000 military documents from the Iraq war that were leaked to the site.

The leaking of the documents raised the immediate ire of military officials although soon after the posting they questioned the documents' significance. Back in July, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Adm. Mike Mullen, said he was "appalled" by the leak but said the documents were from previous years up to 2009 and "much has changed since then."

Despite this, the military warned that the naming of Afghans was a huge concern. Wikileaks has "the blood of some young soldier or that of an Afghan family" on their hands, Mullen said.

In addition to the document review, the military has launched a criminal investigation into the leak. Since the initial publication of the documents, military officials consider Army Pfc. Bradley Manning a prime suspect in the leak. Manning is already being held in Quantico, Virginia, charged with leaking video of an Iraq airstrike to WikiLeaks as well as removing classified information from military computers.

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 7:24 pm 
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Despite this, the military warned that the naming of Afghans was a huge concern. Wikileaks has "the blood of some young soldier or that of an Afghan family" on their hands, Mullen said.


LMAO! they taking the piss?? or is this meant to be some joke...the US/west adminstration has the blood of thousands of lives on its hands including that of its own soldiers and its blaming wiki leaks for 'some'... :tap:

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 7:26 pm 
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Manutd4Ever wrote:
i dnt think many 'insurgents' hiding in the mountains or the civillians living in their smashed up homes are gonna be reading this on the net or on bbc world news are they, thats just some sad excuse i think, the leaders who put them there in the first place have put their lives at risk, dropping white phophorous, depleated uranium on them is gonna put their lives at even greater risk.

this is something they didnt want out, but thanks to wikileaks atleast all those muppets who think the sun shines out the arse's of our military can sit down and take note of whats been really going on.


Considering all you need for net access these days is a mobile phone, chances are at least some of them can get it. :dunno: And I agree to some extent it's an excuse, they just want to make Wikileaks out to be dangerous so they can justify taking action against them... they even started accusing the owner of rape at one point!

But you have to accept the possibility that it could, in theory, be a risk to soldiers and collaborators' lives. It just hasn't so far. That said, I'm not over bothered about extra risk for soldiers, and fully support these documents being made available. They've also been screened by Wikileaks before they're published, they had to considering the US Defence people refused the chance to do the same.

And I doubt it... people who think the sun shines out of the military sphincters will just believe the official line, that's Wikileaks is putting troops at risk by releasing dangerous information... you don't actually think any of them will read it do you? :rolleyes:

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 7:36 pm 
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conscience wrote:
Manutd4Ever wrote:
i dnt think many 'insurgents' hiding in the mountains or the civillians living in their smashed up homes are gonna be reading this on the net or on bbc world news are they, thats just some sad excuse i think, the leaders who put them there in the first place have put their lives at risk, dropping white phophorous, depleated uranium on them is gonna put their lives at even greater risk.

this is something they didnt want out, but thanks to wikileaks atleast all those muppets who think the sun shines out the arse's of our military can sit down and take note of whats been really going on.


Considering all you need for net access these days is a mobile phone, chances are at least some of them can get it. :dunno: And I agree to some extent it's an excuse, they just want to make Wikileaks out to be dangerous so they can justify taking action against them... they even started accusing the owner of rape at one point!

But you have to accept the possibility that it could, in theory, be a risk to soldiers and collaborators' lives. It just hasn't so far. That said, I'm not over bothered about extra risk for soldiers, and fully support these documents being made available. They've also been screened by Wikileaks before they're published, they had to considering the US Defence people refused the chance to do the same.

And I doubt it... people who think the sun shines out of the military sphincters will just believe the official line, that's Wikileaks is putting troops at risk by releasing dangerous information... you don't actually think any of them will read it do you? :rolleyes:



but i think people in Iraq/afghan etc know what the US army is doing there, them hearing this wont be anything new,this mostly for us to read and know about. oh i think they will read it/hear about/watch it on the news, but then when it comes to justifying what were doing over there or choosing to ignore whats been made public its gonna be interesting to see what they say.

well 1 day in the media spotlight and now its just gonna be brushed under the carpet, the soldiers that commited these crimes,rape/torture/murder etc wont even be investigated. shocking dont u think?

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:33 pm 
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Manutd4Ever wrote:
but i think people in Iraq/afghan etc know what the US army is doing there, them hearing this wont be anything new,this mostly for us to read and know about. oh i think they will read it/hear about/watch it on the news, but then when it comes to justifying what were doing over there or choosing to ignore whats been made public its gonna be interesting to see what they say.

well 1 day in the media spotlight and now its just gonna be brushed under the carpet, the soldiers that commited these crimes,rape/torture/murder etc wont even be investigated. shocking dont u think?



Of course they are taking the p1ss lol. Propaganda/spin/lies... call it what you like, by their own admission it caused no security problems at all which makes it even more laughable that they're still saying this is a risk to national security! :blink:

Obviously the people there do know the score, but awareness over here in the West, imo, isn't as low as you think... I think you might be surprised how many people over here already know all about what's going on... None of the stuff Lowkey & Co. talks about is new news, it's been out there for a long time.... the latest stuff just adds to the list. But even when it's reported in the mainstream media people just skim over it and buy the official story, for various reasons. Even when you explain it to some people, you get either a why should I care attitude, agreement and "isn't it awful" followed by a question about what time the I'm a Celebrity Factor is on, or a complete denial because it doesn't agree with the TV/tabloids and they look at you like you're a traitor. Chances are they'll only read the headline in the newspaper or on TV, not many will read the leaked info or check anything that the media says.

Did you watch the Iraq enquiry when Tony Blair and later Gordon Brown were asked questions and asked to justify it? Just in case you didn't, they were allowed to dodge questions and shrug their shoulders, blame others, say they didn't know etc. and all sorts of crap - then it was over and nothing was done about it... and that's all that'll happen this time too in all probability. Hopefully when the people who care are in the majority, then change can be forced because let's face it... the people in charge only get away with this stuff because we let them.... or just don't object hard enough. There's a brilliant quote about all it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing, but that's all it takes for it to continue.

And yes, I think it's horrific. Unfortunately to be shocked you have to not be expecting it. :(

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:53 pm 
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Manutd4Ever wrote:
but i think people in Iraq/afghan etc know what the US army is doing there, them hearing this wont be anything new,this mostly for us to read and know about. oh i think they will read it/hear about/watch it on the news, but then when it comes to justifying what were doing over there or choosing to ignore whats been made public its gonna be interesting to see what they say.

....the soldiers that commited these crimes,rape/torture/murder etc wont even be investigated. shocking dont u think?

i also think it's shocking that you attribute these crimes solely to 'western soldiers' when a vast number of the leaks outline attrocities such as rape & torture, to the Iraqi forces

You seem content to pass summary judgement on US & British forces, yet happy to overlook the ACTUAL CONTENT & reluctant to be as critical of the Iraqis who are committing the crimes.

Again, you seem more willing to knock Western govts, than condemn the perpetrators of the crimes, it's Iraqis doing the torturing

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 10:25 pm 
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MU4E - RJ's got a point imo. You need to see that it's not just Western evilness... there is bad stuff happening but it's far from one sided, you need to recognise that while you're right to be concerned and appalled if that's how you feel it's not one side bad the other good. Whoever is doing the bad stuff may be in league with the West, but they aren't only us doing this stuff. There's a danger of limiting your view to just a Muslim/banking/Jew/race/class/whatever conspiracy, when in fact the reality is quite different. If you're gunna take sides, side with the ones not responsible, and no one country or side can claim that 100% imho.

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 10:57 pm 
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It appears to be assumed that all the leaks detail US crimes.

The reality is ALOT of the leaks are US accounts of Iraqi on Iraqi atrocities that the military are forbidden from intervening in, due to a frago. eg executions in Talafar

The leaks also outline Iranian weapons supply by The Islamic Revolution Corps

The leaked reports (also) outline Iraqis using electric drills & electrocution for torture, which the US troops were forbidden to stop, due to an agreement with Nouri al-Maliki's govt.


So..... (imo) if you want to be taken seriously as a proponent of freedon of information/speech, i recommend you don't start out with an agenda, make sure you are furnished with all the facts & don't adopt the same selective, propagandist, monocular, censored tactics used by those you vehemently denounce...

....yes the leaks contain abhorrent acts by US/UK troops but also Shia & Sunni Iraqis, don't just sweep the ones that don't suit your politics under the carpet.... that's as despicable imo

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 11:35 pm 
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yes agree i should have put in Iraqi forces aswell, my bad. but what i also dont understand is if the US was over there to stop all these bad things happening to the poor people of iraq then why not intervene? u say they had an agreement..what to not stop torture?..well well..though these iraqi soldiers were trained by the US/british military..looks like we know what they are being trained in eh...hmmm

Here's a helpful hint: If you break into someone's house to steal, everyone inside is innocent. You can't claim 'self-defense' if you harm them to protect yourself. Same goes for when the house is a country.

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 11:36 pm 
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conscience wrote:
MU4E - RJ's got a point imo. You need to see that it's not just Western evilness... there is bad stuff happening but it's far from one sided, you need to recognise that while you're right to be concerned and appalled if that's how you feel it's not one side bad the other good. Whoever is doing the bad stuff may be in league with the West, but they aren't only us doing this stuff. There's a danger of limiting your view to just a Muslim/banking/Jew/race/class/whatever conspiracy, when in fact the reality is quite different. If you're gunna take sides, side with the ones not responsible, and no one country or side can claim that 100% imho.



why do i have this sneaky suspicion that the US was in on most of this torture thats been goin on..

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 11:58 pm 
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Manutd4Ever wrote:
Here's a helpful hint: If you break into someone's house to steal, everyone inside is innocent


Tell that to Tony Martin.

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:01 am 
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Manutd4Ever wrote:
yes agree i should have put in Iraqi forces aswell, my bad. but what i also dont understand is if the US was over there to stop all these bad things happening to the poor people of iraq then why not intervene? u say they had an agreement..what to not stop torture?..well well..though these iraqi soldiers were trained by the US/british military..looks like we know what they are being trained in eh...hmmm

The US/UK undertook to not interfere in Iraqi Security Forces operations by request of the Iraqi govt, nor report them, for fear of antagonising civil unrest

....& 'they trained them' is hardly an excuse, particularly as they have a rather long history of it & many of the leaks took the form of complaints to US commanders, so making the excuse 'the Yanks made 'em do it' further highlights a 'bias', that excuse never got Rudolf Hess/half the Serbian army off

take some responsibility (general)

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:12 am 
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Resurrection Joe wrote:
Manutd4Ever wrote:
yes agree i should have put in Iraqi forces aswell, my bad. but what i also dont understand is if the US was over there to stop all these bad things happening to the poor people of iraq then why not intervene? u say they had an agreement..what to not stop torture?..well well..though these iraqi soldiers were trained by the US/british military..looks like we know what they are being trained in eh...hmmm

The US/UK undertook to not interfere in Iraqi Security Forces operations by request of the Iraqi govt, nor report them, for fear of antagonising civil unrest

....& 'they trained them' is hardly an excuse, particularly as they have a rather long history of it & many of the leaks took the form of complaints to US commanders, so making the excuse 'the Yanks made 'em do it' further highlights a 'bias', that excuse never got Rudolf Hess/half the Serbian army off

take some responsibility (general)



so what your sayin is that it was good they didnt interfere because that way it was all kept hush hush and the people of iraq were non the wiser? sadam was torturing his own people, now this new gov the US has put in is doin it...oh my.

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 Post subject: Re: Wikileaks outs 400000 classified Iraq War docs
PostPosted: Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:32 am 
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no that's not what i'm saying

i'm saying that the Iraqi govt said 'you pull out, we must be allowed to be in charge & govern how we see fit.... or we won't co-operate'

Yanks backed off as it suited their withdrawal strategy

Iraqis whipped out the Black & Deckers, Yanks complained to their commanders

Wikileaks uncovered this inhumanity

You completely overlooked it

....yet somehow feel compelled to 'spin' this as exclusively a US govt atrocity....

if they stop someone doing it, they're wrong, if they do it, they're wrong, if someone else does it & they don't stop it, they're wrong

....how's about (some) Iraqis are c*nts too & you just don't want to say it, cos Lowkey wouldn't like it?

i don't think you even read the leaks

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